Hawkwinter:

 

Mmm...no? All customers are not worth the trouble. 

Business decisions are and should be made in favor of the largest benefit for the company and the largest/best group of customers. You will not and cannot satisfy 100% of the people, and the expense/trouble involved in trying to do so will sink any company. Why? Because there are always people who will not be satisfied with anything. Face it, some customers are there not for goods or services, but to entertain themselves through mischief. Plenty of ranting from that sort here, but they aren't the majority, nor even a significant minority.

And no, people like that are not worth the trouble professionally.

Actually, you are talking about different things. All customers are worth the trouble. PERIOD.

If you find that in a cost/benefit ratio you can only please 75% of your marketing sector, you make a choice to not respond to the wants of the other 25%. That's acceptable. However, you had best consider EVERY option that will get you close to 100%. I know there will always be a malcontent or two...or 100...but even their dissent can bring about a solution that will gain you an additonal customer or two.

You say there's nothing GenCon can do, or shouldn't spend the money to do it. I simply state that given what I and many others here know...the potential to alleviate a great deal of problems..maybe even solve the issue...is not costly, and highly available. If there's another reason...we may not know it. I do know however, that even IF there's no cost ratio that can solve this problem...the talk that some people aren't WORTH it....is what makes people walk away from companies, because eventually they look that way at everyone. I don't think GC is guilty of this, but I definately wouldn't want you guys in my customer service.

Right now, the way I see it with Event Registration Day in the equivalent of face-to-face business, is Gencon is essentially hiring two or three clerks to handle the requests of 20,000+ people - at the same time. They do need to rework the site and the database. They do need the additional servers. Without those improvements - and they only need to be temporary fixes, not a couple of servers taking up space in someone's office - people will walk away, without saying a word. The loudest feedback is from the lack of customers.

Investing to satisfy your customers is imperative in any and every business. Would you invest millions to catch the attention of one customer and retain him? No, that's completely unrealistic - well, unless you're trying to secure a 20-year, multi-million dollar contract with Microsoft. Is it unreasonable to invest thousands of dollars to satisfy - and keep - thousands of customers? Not in the least.

Are there customers who aren't worth keeping? Sadly, I do have to agree with that. At Domino's, there are a couple of apartments - literally right across the hall from each other so we're confident they know the people know each other - that will either complain about perfectly good food just to get us to send out more free food or will prank us; they'll order thirty or forty dollars worth of food and then when the driver gets there, they'll say they didn't order anything. Last time they called, it was an actual order. Of course, they would've saved all of us a lot of time if they had given us the correct address in the first place. The night managers and some of the drivers want to cut them off - either deny them any future service or tell them they either have to give us a credit card number over the phone or come in and pay for the order beforehand. But management doesn't want us to do that. Why, I don't know, but they want to keep them happy, despite the abuse.

facade:

Braelun:

facade:

Every customer is worth it? Really? The shoplifters are worth it? Those just looking for a reason to sue you are worth it? Those who vandalize your property are worth it?

I wouldn't consider those individuals as customers.  To me, a customer is a person who is there to purchase a product or service that is for sale.  The shoplifter, potential lawsuit and vandal aren't there for that; they are only there to serve themselves.

They are people who are entering your business claiming to be customers. In the end you have to make a decision whether you want them as a customer or not. For some the choice is easy. Obviously you catch someone stealing you don't want them back. But what about the less obvious crooks like those are looking for any excuse to demand their meal for free? Or those who buy clothes just to wear it at an event with the intention of returning it the next day? There are a lot of dishonest people out there. There are a lot of people with unrealistic expectaions. There are a lot of people without any consideration for anyone but themselves. If you are selling popcorn on the street you can shoot for 100%. If you have to factor in theft, dishonesty, vandals, inconsideration, insurance and service time your percentage is going to be a lot lower.

Facade, I'm sorry, but I'm starting to get the impression that you're arguing just for the sake of arguing here, that you're not actually trying to make a point.

CraftyShafty:

Perspective moment: this is a small (in the scheme of real revenues), once-a-year entertainment event. There's not really any good reason for folks to get that upset over whether or not they got Harry Potter LARP tickets in the timeslot they wanted, or if they chose to spend part of their afternoon trying to get those tickets. This is such a luxury as to be unimaginable to the vast majority of people around the globe.

So as we sit here typing on our internet-connected computers, in our environmentally-controlled homes/offices, eating our snacks, enjoying our money-making, non-slave-labor jobs, arguing about whether or not a game convention company should or shouldn't spend more of our dollars on a ticket registration process, maybe, just maybe, we can try to keep a little perspective and not get quite so arrogant about our "rights" as consumers or indignant about how inconvenient all of this fun is.

Can't argue with this. We can come off as a pretty spoiled country. But rather than deflecting the subject at hand, we the consumer do have a certain level of expectation - and to an extent, right - of customer service from a professional company. When those expectations aren't being met - and appear to be considered inconsequential by the business - we do have a right, in this country, to voice our opinions. We may be a vocal minority but I'm certain there is a good number of non-vocal people out there who feel similarly.

Marquis - I understand that the availability of the tickets are limited and thats prefectly fine, if I was able to get onto the server and try to order and got shot down because someone else got them, that would be a totaly different story, and i would have to deal with that, but not even having an opportunity to fight for them is garbage. Facade - Underwriting is one thing, and again, the customer is still given a chance, and we try to find a way to make them insurable, but if they arent, they just arent and the customers understand this process and know this is a possibility. I would never expect to try to log on here and just not be able to, I would assume that a company putting on a major event like this (any annual event that has thousands of people attend can be considered a major event), would have the capability to handle whatever amount of people trying to get on to their site, which just wasnt the case, and they are losing customers because of it. Lets just say that 20 people arent going because of this (I know at least 8 personally, and have red a few more that have posted here, so it is a reasonable number). Thats over $1200 that they are losing out on because of their server issues. Thats a lot of money to lose. I think that the 20 customers is worth the hassle.

Okay guys, you are starting to get close to that line of baiting and flaming each other. Let's keep this civil please. We're all entitled to our own opinions but there is no need to get close or even allow ourselves to get close by calling each other names and what not, which is where I am seeing this heading, at which point this thread will be lock till cooler heads will and can prevail. Now let's get back to the issue at hand.

I've already stated I am anti-draft lottery. But its not been that long since I worked at Best Buy and in the Customer Service department or manager department and let me tell you in every company every single customer is important.

We may not agree with everything they have to say and when all is said and done they may still leave upset, hurt, and angry. But they are important, each customer especially the upset ones teach a vaulable lesson. Where did a company go wrong and what can we do to fix it? Sometimes you can't fix it and sometimes you can.

What we know the server it did not get all the traffic thru in a timely manner that we all aproved of.

What we seem to of forgotten from years past: The website and forums did not crash this year like in years past. Big accomplishment that something is getting fixed.

What we don't know: How many people tried to access the reg site on Sunday. And in years past how many people try to access it. And if they did buy servers to help with the amount of people on last year.

And I do think that a Draft Lottery would be a bad move, because it doesn't allow for planning the way we would like it too. Both have pro's and con's. And I'd take a bottleneck server anyday over not knowing till Gen Con if I got what I wanted or not.

NDGeekboy:

Can't argue with this. We can come off as a pretty spoiled country. But rather than deflecting the subject at hand,

 

...you'll attempt to deflect the subject at hand. 

"Having a certain level of expectation" is exactly what we're talking about. Talking about ones "rights" as a consumer is, particularly for something so trivial, quite silly. You have the right to attend the convention, all other factors (fire codes, whatever) being equal. You don't have the right to a completely flawless registration experience. You don't have the right to get every or any event tickets. You do have the right to choose to spend your discretionary dollars elsewhere. 

If we're talking "rights" GCLLC has the "right" to cut costs any way possible in order to maximize their profits, and that includes running a registration that is "good enough" for the majority of attendees. 

Again, the talk of rights and expectations is precisely why I think this crying has reached ridiculous proportions here. This is a luxury for all of us - please try to remember that when getting so passionate and indignant about your "rights" and "expectations".

For more perspective on things, visit  Global Rich List

While it may make some people feel a little uncomfortable (and in some cases, oh-so defensive), I again say examine your life, the wealth and privilege that permit you to indulge in something so entertaining as attending a game convention. Now compare that to how the other 90% of the world lives and think how much you're complaining about a little inconvenience to your vacation plans.

 Nope, the system isn't perfect. GCLLC is far from perfect. The system is better than the old lottery, and the online registration continues to improve each year. Still not perfect, but hardly worth the vehemence spewed by a few disappointed, privileged consumers. 

as far as my opinion goes... upgrade the system for Hotel and Event reg days and leave everythign else alone.  No draft lottery, no more VIG plans, ect...  Get the system we have in place able to handle the load put on it for those days and everything will be fine.

CraftyShafty:

"Having a certain level of expectation" is exactly what we're talking about. Talking about ones "rights" as a consumer is, particularly for something so trivial, quite silly.

Just for clarification, could you tell me what you're referring to as "trivial" here?  The convention?  The time one can lose due to the registration process?  Or something else? 

 

You don't have the right to a completely flawless registration experience. You don't have the right to get every or any event tickets.

Has anyone here actually stated that they should have the right to get every event ticket they want, or are you just knocking down straw men?  The issue for most of the posters that I've read on this board is not that events are unavailable, but the lengthy amount of time it takes to find out that the tickets are unavailable. 

 If we're talking "rights" GCLLC has the "right" to cut costs any way possible in order to maximize their profits, and that includes running a registration that is "good enough" for the majority of attendees. 

Of course they do - though whether they're actually maximizing their profits with a flawed registration system is certainly open for discussion, especially when one considers the cost of bad word-of-mouth.   

Again, the talk of rights and expectations is precisely why I think this crying has reached ridiculous proportions here. This is a luxury for all of us - please try to remember that when getting so passionate and indignant about your "rights" and "expectations".

I'll agree with a very small part of what you've written here, if only because by now, "expectations" for Gen Con's registration process should be very low indeed.  But the rest of it...?

People are passionate about their vacations and their hobbies.  They're passionate about their time.  A flawed registration process affects all three. 

It's all well and good to preach about how fortunate we are.  I'm not arguing with those points that you've made.  I will say that in the arena of customer service, they're pretty much irrelevant.  For example, last month I was having trouble with my IPod, so I called Apple's customer service number.  At no point did this ever happen:

Me:  Yes, I'm having trouble with an error message that comes up when I try to synchronize my IPod with my ITunes library.

Apple Rep:  You know, there's people in Darfur who would trade places with you in a heartbeat.   

Why not?  Because customer service is not about reminding the customer how lucky they are.  It's about doing everything in your power to make a customer happy.  That doesn't mean you will make all of them happy, but you try.

While it may make some people feel a little uncomfortable (and in some cases, oh-so defensive), I again say examine your life, the wealth and privilege that permit you to indulge in something so entertaining as attending a game convention. Now compare that to how the other 90% of the world lives and think how much you're complaining about a little inconvenience to your vacation plans.

Perhaps it's just me, but imo your "Don't sweat the small stuff" message kind of gets lost in the overall tone of condescension. 

 

and the online registration continues to improve each year.

Since you've stated you dislike it when people state opinions as facts, I'm assuming you have some empirical data to back this up.  Could you please provide a link?  Thank you. 

 

 I see to ways you could fix the problem.

1) charge more money for events, so people would chew through fewer high priority slots. or

2) Do an auction system where you could bid on slots either using real money, or better yet, an equal number of points per person. then you could run an ebay auction of slots where people could spend more points to get there top picks and use leftover points to fill there schedule.

Either way you get closer to a fair value of the events slots based on demand. However, if events generated more cash, we could probably get more events/GMs/etc due to the increased monetary incentive. Thus providing more slots to better meet demand until we get a leveling effect between price and numbmer of slots.

Watchdog:

Just for clarification, could you tell me what you're referring to as "trivial" here?  The convention? The time one can lose due to the registration process?  Or something else? 

Both, the convention in particular. I love my hobbies as much (ok, more) than most, but let's not get carried away with ourselves. Attending a game convention is still just entertainment. And one doesn't really "lose" time to the registration, you spend it. Is this worth the time to wait in line for an event? You decide through your actions. 

Has anyone here actually stated that they should have the right to get every event ticket they want, or are you just knocking down straw men? 

 

Oh come now. Surely you're being disingenuous with this. That is the argument that underpins almost every rant on these forums: "I didn't get the events I wanted, therefore I am angry!" I haven't seen many "I waited for two hours, got all of my events, and I am angry!" posts. I don't have to explicitly state "I enjoy GenCon enough to post on these forums and discuss these topics." The nature and number of posts indicate this already. But you already know this.

 

Perhaps it's just me, but imo your "Don't sweat the small stuff" message kind of gets lost in the overall tone of condescension.

Yup, just you. Heh. Sorry if you take it that way, but that's certainly not the intent. Quite the contrary, actually.

No, I have no interest or desire to be condescending. I have no interest in claiming a moral "high horse". The fact that I post here shows that I love my hobbies and game conventions more than most - simply by being here. The vast majority of attendees don't visit these forums, let alone post, so we are a small subset within a small group. So I include myself in all of this, so don't get 'holier than thou' with 'holier than thou' arguments. 

But I agree, my message is getting lost, but it's getting lost in a sea of entitlement and lack of perspective, and the way people take exception with my statements that this is blown all out of proportion only demonstrates this. 

Using your example, you are free to call Apple when there's a problem with your toy. By all means. Ranting and raging about the injustice of it all, arguing vehemently about ones 'rights', castigating Apple, denigrating anyone who disagrees or (in some cases) merely points out the disproportionate response...these things are far outside the realm of reason. Because after all, it's still just a toy you're talking about. 

Since you've stated you dislike it when people state opinions as facts, I'm assuming you have some empirical data to back this up.  Could you please provide a link?  Thank you. 

 

 

Please reference the after-action reports posted in previous years by GCLLC representatives for exactly what I'm referring to - they will say just that. For clear comparisons that we've lived through in the past five years of online registration we may also ask the following questions: Did the servers and forums crash? Nope. Has happened previously. Was registration postponed days? Nope. Has happened previously. Was the worst of the server load issue resolved within the first hours of registration this year? Yes. Hasn't happened previously. See: posts from GCLLC this and previous years.

So, while they still don't have their act completely together, the registration process does improve each year, some more than others. That's a fact. Whether or not it's "good enough" to each customer is opinion, and I continue to advocate voting with one's wallet when it comes to customer service.

But in the face of clear progress, customer service seems to be what a few people want fall back to criticizing, and that's perfectly fine. GCLLC has provided forums specifically dedicated to customer service issues. They've also provided contact information so people can request assistance, offer suggestions, and all those other things we like. That contact information is by far the more helpful, and I suggest people avail themselves of it. Plus, you have the chance to complain to the man in person at GC. To use your previous example, I doubt Apple customer service (who, by the way, has had me on hold for longer than GC's registration took) will transfer me up to Steve Jobs if I complain long enough. 

Because customer service is not about reminding the customer how lucky they are.

Evidently that's my job.   Doesn't have a paycheck, though. [:'(]

I haven't seen anyone from GCLLC (including their volunteer mods) say anything of the sort, by the way. No one has said "Why are you complaining?" They've been providing answers and kissing booty the way we expect customer service to behave in the United States. You won't see any sort of grand bloodletting or confessional from Peter Adkinson for some time, but we've even had that in the past so I wouldn't be surprised. And again, you will have the opportunity to converse/complain/rant/whatever with the man at GenCon. 

I hope my comments above answer your questions and clarify some of your misconceptions. I don't, however, intend to argue this out with anyone. If someone chooses to feel aggrieved over the registration process in spite of reasonable perspectives and responses to the contrary, they will do so. I trust I will still see a good number of them at the convention, claims to the contrary notwithstanding. 

Oh, and you're welcome.

 

 

...but hardly worth the vehemence spewed by a few disappointed, privileged consumers. 

It's not vehemence to ask a provider of a service to re-evaluate a business decision. If they do, great. If they don't..eh. Like you said..I'll be back for as long as I think the benefit outweighs the cost.

I hardly see posting in an internet forum about dissatisfaction with a process as an indication of our arrogance and entitlement, no more so than posting about people who do complain makes you condescending....its perspective.

My only point is...and it goes back to the lottery...You run a sandwich shop that uses a rolling salamander. It toasts your sandwiches. On typical lunch days it performs fine, and everyone's sandwich comes out right. On heavy traffic days it has a tendency to burn 1 out every 10 sandwiches, as it has a faulty thermostat. You, as the owner, can make a decision...fix the thermostat (money) or take the hit to C.S. from giving people a burnt sandwich.

If you decide to not fix the machine:

1. The customer is not a malcontent because he does not like a burnt sandwich
2. The fix is NOT to randomize your menu so that everyone has a supposed equal chance to get a burnt sandwich they may not have ordered.
3. You do not tell the customer that he should be glad he didn't get a burnt sandwich AND an order of burnt fries like last year.

The other option, fixing the thermostat has a potentila for causing problems too. If your customer status remains static, you may never be able to pay off the required fix. This indicates bigger problems than just a faulty thermostat. It could also lead to problems as , due to customers telling others that they don't get burnt sandwiches at your shop, you now have to add another line for all the new customers. What a headache that could be, huh?

Its a forum post about being unsatisfied with something I paid for...that's all. If it irritates you to see such gross displays of entitlement...I am sorry, may I suggest the "What went right" thread.

 

PunkRockSonja:

Okay guys, you are starting to get close to that line of baiting and flaming each other. Let's keep this civil please. We're all entitled to our own opinions but there is no need to get close or even allow ourselves to get close by calling each other names and what not, which is where I am seeing this heading, at which point this thread will be lock till cooler heads will and can prevail. Now let's get back to the issue at hand.

I've already stated I am anti-draft lottery. But its not been that long since I worked at Best Buy and in the Customer Service department or manager department and let me tell you in every company every single customer is important.

We may not agree with everything they have to say and when all is said and done they may still leave upset, hurt, and angry. But they are important, each customer especially the upset ones teach a vaulable lesson. Where did a company go wrong and what can we do to fix it? Sometimes you can't fix it and sometimes you can.

What we know the server it did not get all the traffic thru in a timely manner that we all aproved of.

What we seem to of forgotten from years past: The website and forums did not crash this year like in years past. Big accomplishment that something is getting fixed.

What we don't know: How many people tried to access the reg site on Sunday. And in years past how many people try to access it. And if they did buy servers to help with the amount of people on last year.

And I do think that a Draft Lottery would be a bad move, because it doesn't allow for planning the way we would like it too. Both have pro's and con's. And I'd take a bottleneck server anyday over not knowing till Gen Con if I got what I wanted or not.

I use to work the Customer service at BestBuy, it is NOT a good job at all I wouldnt wish it on anyone. Unless you like being yelled at things thrown at you then go for it! lol

 Draft lottery would be a bad mood, its just a luck of the draw kindof thing. Last year I was lucky with some things and unlucky with others, its happens. You can satisfy everyone.

katsobsession:

You can satisfy everyone.

Wow, Best Buy must have truly exceptional customer service.

avatarart:

katsobsession:

You can satisfy everyone.

Wow, Best Buy must have truly exceptional customer service.

bah! I meant cant! and you know! dang it....lol

Hawkwinter:

The fix is NOT to randomize your menu so that everyone has a supposed equal chance to get a burnt sandwich they may not have ordered.

I'd do this only if it included a free drink and cookie.  Big cookie too.

come on everyone, can't we all get along, we all love our hobby, we all have(or atleast should have) learned that we will not always get what we want.

let's all just go to this wonderful gathering of gamers/gm's and enjoy ourselves.

I for one am looking forward to having a great time with some great people, and hopefully we all can look past the amount of time taken to register.

CraftyShafty:

Watchdog:

Has anyone here actually stated that they should have the right to get every event ticket they want, or are you just knocking down straw men? 

 

Oh come now. Surely you're being disingenuous with this. That is the argument that underpins almost every rant on these forums: "I didn't get the events I wanted, therefore I am angry!" I haven't seen many "I waited for two hours, got all of my events, and I am angry!" posts. I don't have to explicitly state "I enjoy GenCon enough to post on these forums and discuss these topics." The nature and number of posts indicate this already. But you already know this.

 

Actually, I'm one of those people who was online for over 2-1/2 hours, got just about everything he wanted, and am still upset at having to be on for that length of time. Ten minutes, no problem; 2-1/2 hours - problem.

I think the underlying theme of the ranting is more along the lines of "Because the registration system is flawed, everyone doesn't have an equal (or as close to an equal) chance to get their tickets." If the system worked properly, registration would be strictly first-come, first-served. People would accept that (well, most people anyway <g>). But because the system locks up and locks out people, we don't have that equal chance.

Pre-registration is pretty much the equivalent of a race. There shouldn't be any variances in the track, and the race determined only by the contestants themselves. This is more like an uninvited game combining Blood Bowl and Paranoia - the Computer is not our friend and we don't know when Crazy Harry's going to start lobbing his bombs at us.

 

CraftyShafty:

 And one doesn't really "lose" time to the registration, you spend it. Is this worth the time to wait in line for an event? You decide through your actions. 

Compared to the amount of time it takes to register for similar events, the time is lost.  The nature of the problem even makes it difficult to multitask if you have to keep watching the screen for a timed out message.  It's not like the "ding" in the Southwest commercials where you could be alerted that the system was ready while you did something more productive. 

 

Oh come now. Surely you're being disingenuous with this. That is the argument that underpins almost every rant on these forums: "I didn't get the events I wanted, therefore I am angry!" I haven't seen many "I waited for two hours, got all of my events, and I am angry!" posts. I don't have to explicitly state "I enjoy GenCon enough to post on these forums and discuss these topics." The nature and number of posts indicate this already. But you already know this.

 

No, I'm not being disingenuous.  And don't call me Shirley.

Imo, most of the posts express disappointment that they didn't get the events they wanted.  They express anger that it took several hours to get the bad news.  There's a difference.  Most of the posters understand that the former is inevitable when you have so many potential customers for so few event tickets.  The latter is a fixable problem - or at least it is according to people with far more understanding of IT systems than I.

But I agree, my message is getting lost, but it's getting lost in a sea of entitlement and lack of perspective, and the way people take exception with my statements that this is blown all out of proportion only demonstrates this. 

Again, speaking only for myself, it was your words that were responsible for clouding the message, not the comments/responses from other posters.  One example of what I felt was the condescending tone was the "oh-so defensive" remark.  I can give others if you'd like. 

Using your example, you are free to call Apple when there's a problem with your toy. By all means. Ranting and raging about the injustice of it all, arguing vehemently about ones 'rights', castigating Apple, denigrating anyone who disagrees or (in some cases) merely points out the disproportionate response...these things are far outside the realm of reason. Because after all, it's still just a toy you're talking about. 

First, just as I didn't rant and rage or castigate Apple when I called about my IPod, many people are posting about their frustrating experiences here without behaving as you're describing, at least not in my eyes.  There's certainly been some venting, but I haven't seen many examples of what I could consider "hate mail" if they were addressed to a specific individual in an email or letter.  (Perhaps being married to someone who works retail has given me access to more egregious examples of poorly behaved customers.)  When you characterize everyone who's complained about the registration process like this, you're painting with a very wide brush. 

Second, is Gen Con also "just a toy"?   That's one way to look at it.  Another way is that someone who goes every year, spending Wednesday - Sunday at or in travel to/from the convention, is going to spend 1.3% of their life there.  And that's not including any prep time for hotel registration, event registration, or event preparation for those of us who run events there.  To me, that's a substantial time committment. 

 If that committment and the passion for the convention itself aren't enough to justify the most extreme emotional reactions from a few people, they are imo enough to cut said people a little slack when it happens.  YMMV. 

 

CraftyShafty:

That is the argument that underpins almost every rant on these forums: "I didn't get the events I wanted, therefore I am angry!" I haven't seen many "I waited for two hours, got all of my events, and I am angry!" posts.